Pennies To Pounds Podcast

126. The Money Lessons That Changed Everything ft Anna Brading

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In this episode, writer, financial educator and all-around gem Anna Brading joins Kia to unpack the real link between money and confidence, why financial advice often leaves women behind, and what it actually takes to rewrite your money story in your 20s and 30s.

From early money trauma to navigating imposter syndrome and building a life on your own terms, Anna shares the lessons she’s learned and the bold decisions that changed everything.

We talk about:

  • Why your confidence shouldn’t depend on your bank balance
  • The quiet financial decisions that actually build freedom
  • Owning your story, even when it feels messy or late
  • What inspired Anna’s new book 'Money Mentor' — and how it redefines success

Whether you’re in your broke era, healing era, or boss era — this one’s for you.

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Speaker 1:

Penny to Pounds podcast the finance show that actually makes sense. If you've ever asked yourself, why didn't you teach us this at school? Or how do I get my money up without giving up things I love, you're in the right place. We simplify money, dispel the myths and give you the playbook to build wealth on your own terms, because money moves fast and it's time that yours kept up. Welcome back everyone. I'm excited to bring you another episode of the Penny to Pounds podcast. This one is going to be a really good one, and it's actually our first time with this brand new format, and I've got an incredible guest with me to help induct us with this new format. So, guest, who are you?

Speaker 2:

Hi, I'm Anna Braiding. I'm a finance content creator. I teach financial literacy, much like yourself, Kia.

Speaker 1:

Yes.

Speaker 2:

Author of Money Mentor. Yeah, I just I love talking about this stuff because I feel like it's genuinely life-changing when you get your head around it. We weren't taught it like no head, and I think it really makes a difference when we yeah, we fully understand these concepts and and like you say as well, it's moving fast, so we've got to keep on top of it. So, yeah, um, that's me amazing.

Speaker 1:

I'm super excited to have you on because you are incredible. Not only do have the pleasure of knowing you, because you're an incredible content creator, but I just think you're amazing in the kind of content that you put out. I think sometimes personal finance content can feel as though you're not doing enough. You know, and I think you really make a safe space for people to learn about money, so I'm super happy that we can make this work and you're on the podcast.

Speaker 2:

That's a nice thing to say, and just to say as well. We're book twins, aren't we? We are book twins, our book came out on the same day oh yeah, same day.

Speaker 1:

I was honestly so happy. I was so excited when our books came out.

Speaker 2:

It was amazing yours is on my shelf there, so yours is mine.

Speaker 1:

Yep, that's my book twin honestly, I was so happy so I made sure that I had yours pre-ordered so we had both of ours.

Speaker 2:

I was like I love it.

Speaker 1:

I love it. Amazing. Right, we're gonna go into our brand new format. So what we're starting off with is our 60 second quick fire money myth busters. I've got five questions for you. We've got 60 seconds on the clock and we're gonna try and get through as many questions as possible. You just give us as long or as short of an answer, but remember, we've got 60 seconds. I'm gonna watch the clock down there and let's go. So owning a home is always better than renting not true.

Speaker 2:

It depends on your situation and it depends on what you're trying to achieve, and this thing no one talks about. It depends what you want your life to look like, because some people they want to be able to move around quickly, they want to be able to travel, and then owning a home locks you in in a way that renting might not.

Speaker 1:

So it totally depends on the situation love that you have to cut back on everything to save money no way absolutely not value-based budgeting.

Speaker 2:

What is important to you, what do you value the most? Prioritize those things. Cut back on the things that you can care less about amazing.

Speaker 1:

Investing is only for rich people no, wrong, that's it wrong, wrong. Okay, credit cards are bad full stop.

Speaker 2:

No, I I disagree with that one. I think they are for a specific purpose. They can be useful for certain things, like building your credit score, reward points, but they're also pretty dangerous if you uh fall into the trap of overspending love that last one, just squeeze it in.

Speaker 1:

If you earn more, your money problems disappear no, no, they don't um.

Speaker 2:

More money, more problems, love that you made it.

Speaker 1:

You actually made it in 60 seconds. Well done, anna. That's really fun. Those were incredible answers and I thought we got a lot of insight in you from you. Sorry, yeah, in 60 seconds, so you did really well. I know it felt daunting, didn't it? Those good questions, though, thank you. Thank you really good questions. Right now, I'm excited to actually get into the topic of today, so we're going to talk about how we can actually build wealth and what that looks like, because I think there's this perception online that you need to earn a certain amount to be able to start building wealth, or you need to be in a certain position or have a certain kind of upbringing, but I want us to kind of go through that and dispel some of that right now. So the first question is do you believe that everyone is actually ready to build wealth, or do some people need to unlearn certain things first?

Speaker 2:

yeah, I think um, definitely not everyone's ready. I wasn't when I started out. I think there's so many things and pitfalls we can fall into that keep us stuck in our financial lives that we have to we do have to unpick, we have to look at so much mindset stuff.

Speaker 2:

Um, people don't like they don't when I work with people, right, they never come. Because they never come work with me, because I think, oh, I've got a mindset thing going on. It's always like budgeting or I want to start a side hustle or whatever, but often it is the mindset thing that they find out and they're like, oh, that was what it was about. So there's a mindset stuff.

Speaker 1:

Um, there's plenty of people on six figures that are still living paycheck to paycheck and that's that's something that we should talk about, because I think people have this perception that once I earn a certain amount, I will be okay, and it's not necessarily about that. It's about how you manage your money, as opposed to how much you earn.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, I think of it as like having holes in your pockets. So my daughter, I got this analogy. It's actually in the book that I wrote it in there because I thought I hope this helps people. Basically, my daughter had this winter coat right when she younger and one day she comes up to me and she's like Mum, I'm putting stuff in my pocket and I'm losing it because there's holes in my pockets and it's all just going into the lining. So, bless her shit like pencils.

Speaker 1:

Oh no, she had everything.

Speaker 2:

It's just falling through into the pockets. And I just thought you know what? Obviously I'm going to buy a new coat, did buy a new coat. But you can sew up those holes in the pockets and then the pocket does what it's meant to do, which is hold the stuff exactly the same in our finances. You can have holes in your finances, so your money it's like it just comes in and they just fall through the gaps and you're like where did that even go? Like I don't even know where that went. So the first thing to do, if you do want to start moving towards building wealth, maybe start investing is to look at okay, where's my money actually going? Have I actually got it all or is it just kind of disappearing through my fingers? Is it all allocated? Is it going where I think it's going? And then that's the point when you've done that, that you can start building and moving forward.

Speaker 1:

I absolutely love that. I think, like I said, it's just changing that mindset and understanding what that looks like because, honestly, anna, if I tell you the amount of conversations I've had of people said, when I just get a pay rise, if I just had this and I'll be able to do it when there's actually a lot more to it. So thank you for helping us to understand that and that analogy the holes in the pocket really does bring it to life. I think it really does help you to visualize what that might look like in your financial life. What money decision for you personally completely changed the game wow, oh, that is such a good question.

Speaker 2:

there'll be a couple of things If we go back. Actually I'll go start more modern day and then I'll go back. So in my money journey and my money story which is why I teach this stuff now is because I didn't know this stuff in my twenties. I had a maths degree. You'd have thought you know you'll be fine, you know numbers you'll be fine.

Speaker 2:

You'll be fine with money, wasn't. So I got married, started building my life with my husband, and a few years go by and we realize we're still not really where we thought we'd be. And now just a caveat just to say that the world's changed too. So there were things that I observed my parents doing with money or how it went for them that were just different for us. So we got stuck and we were like like this is not working in terms of we've got a decent income coming in, but we're not where we thought we'd be. Like what, what's going on here? And so I think the big change for me, the thing that that really unlocked stuff was for me, was like just that understanding and that realization that there's stuff about money you can learn that. We never got taught and you can learn it and anyone can learn it and you and it's so easy to learn now so easy to learn it and and back then it wasn't so much.

Speaker 2:

But there were a few books that I picked up and I and they just opened my eyes and I just thought, wow, there's so much I didn't know and there's so many opportunities out there I didn't know about. Because we kind of go on this hamster wheel, don't we? We go through school and especially if you're quite an academic person I was quite academic and I wanted to do well at school. It's really important to me. So it was kind of like okay, so you've got your GCSEs, then you've got your A levels, and then now what, you're going to university. Okay, so you do well at university, and then it's like bam, become an employee.

Speaker 2:

And for me, I'm well creative as a person. So I just didn't do well in that world. I as an employee. It just I was like I don't, I don't get this, like I get that I need to earn money, but if I just show up at nine and leave at five, no matter how good my work was that day, I get paid the same amount. But it's so not creative. I'm sitting at a laptop all day like it just wasn't.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, I wish someone had taught me about entrepreneurship. I wish I'd known about starting a business. I wish I'd known all these things I know now. So I think when I got that light bulb moment of there are other ways of doing this, there's other ways to earn money that are just as valid, that was like a huge shift um, yeah, massive. And then, if we go back, the thing that I learned which I don't really talk about loads, but I want to start talking about it more is, um, I got taught the thing. One of the things I did get taught growing up was giving oh, I love that.

Speaker 2:

Um, I just it was just a part of my life. So as soon as I got my first paycheck, money goes out and that's just what you do and it's a habit, as much as saving is a habit, because then as you grow and your income grows, it grows too. So you don't wait till you're rich to start giving and giving back and doing those cool things everyone talks about. You know, when I work with people, they're like oh, I'd love to do this in my community, I'd love to do this, I'd love to do that. We can start small, you can start really small and then, as your income grows, you can grow that with it. And so for me, like learning that and then doing that and then doing it consistently my whole life, it's just been just such a joy and such a. I'm just so glad that I got taught that when I was younger.

Speaker 1:

I think that's such a lovely lesson because, like you said, everyone wants to give back.

Speaker 2:

But once there was a certain amount.

Speaker 1:

But I think it's because and I did fall into that in the beginning you have this kind of grandiose idea of how you're going to give back, and I'm going to be do this massive thing. Give back to a thousand people, yeah but really and truly, you can give back to one person, yeah, and you've really done that and then, like you said, as your income increases, you can increase how much you give back. But I think it's because people have this idea that I'm going to change my whole community and feed everyone and no one's going to go hungry.

Speaker 1:

But that is so big that you do have to wait forever. But you don't in reality. And I think the point we made on entrepreneurship. So I was, like you, very academic, went through school, went through sixth form and I'd already I'd always run businesses. So I started at nine and then. So that was primary school and I ran the entirety of secondary school. I was selling cookies and donuts. Then, when I got to sixth form, I was wholesaling hair products. So that was always there. However, it never encouraged, so I never saw it as something I could actually do. I could never really be an entrepreneur. I just thought it's something I could always just make my own side if I need to, but that's it.

Speaker 1:

However, I'm like you. I'm very creative and I don't know if I could be in a space where my creativity can't shine because the amount of ideas I have. Honestly, I think I think you and I should just write a book and just just sell the ideas. Just here you go, they're're all going, you're on, I'm game. I'm game too. Just write down all the ideas and send it to the highest bidder. There you go, because so many ideas I have every single day. I think that's equally as important to learn. There are other options for you, like you mentioned, so that's great. Thank you for sharing those. That's all right. I think there's a stat that came out that says 76% of Gen Z millennials get their financial education online on places like Instagram and TikTok, so it is huge when it comes to that. However, as much as there's great people like yourself, there are not so great people, not so great piece of advice. So I want to ask you what's the worst financial advice or financial tip that you've ever heard on social media? That's a great question.

Speaker 2:

I mean, there's loads of junk out there. You're absolutely right there's. There's loads of just risky things or the you know that you can just quit your job and then you'll be on 10k a month next year, like, or just next week, and it's just like, oh, for goodness sake, it's not how the world works. There's all of that. But then there's here's the thing. Okay, it's not a specific tip or a something someone says. It's. One thing that really bugs me is the tone.

Speaker 2:

So there's a lot of shaming there is there's a lot of shaming people for not doing well in in their finances, and some people actually really love that tough love kind of approach of like you're an idiot, you're in debt, what are you doing? Why are you going to a restaurant? Why are you drinking coffees out if you're in debt? And and it's like there's this tone of like real shaming and calling it on, calling people out and some people yeah, some people really love watching that stuff. But I find that really difficult to stomach because I feel like shaming people because they weren't taught how to handle money and now they're in a bit of a pickle, is awful. I think that's not the way to do it. Um, I think that you've got to understand that everyone's got their own situation going on. You don't know the context. I. I just think we shouldn't be using that kind of tone with people and and I see a lot of that and I don't, I don't get it, I don't, I don't like it I think a lot as well comes from america.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, if you've ever watched like american financial education videos versus uk, americans like to be berated they like to be told.

Speaker 1:

No, they do. I genuinely. They love to be berated. When it comes to the money, honestly, the content is so different. Yeah, they like to get told what you spent that much. How are you broke, you're in debt? They love that and they eat it up. But I think, if you said that in the uk, obviously there is always a subsection of people who enjoy that kind of content, but I think generally across the board, people want to feel welcome and embrace. You know, wherever you are in a situation, you can join us and we'll help you, as opposed to saying you're dreadful, you're like this because you, you are bad with money. You can't get coffees. That's how they are in america. I think it's slowly seeping into the uk, but I'm with you, it's not. It's not my kind of financial content I want to see.

Speaker 1:

Okay, so what's one money tip? Then you would give your friends, but you wouldn't post online.

Speaker 2:

Oh my god, oh well, we're posting this online. So now it's gonna be online. Okay, well, now it will, but but prior to this, prior to this, oh, okay, okay, okay, uh, I'd give to my friends, but I wouldn't post online I think there's a lot of conversations you might have yeah, in your you know your friendship groups about money doesn't need to.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, what would you say to your friends that you maybe wouldn't necessarily make a video on per se?

Speaker 2:

that is such a hard conversation. I think I'm there's. I mean, there's so many topics that come up now, so I'm about to turn 40 this year, so my friends are all kind of at, you know, my school friends and that rule that age and it's so.

Speaker 2:

We've seen each other go through so much stuff, we've been through a lot together. So there's that kind of um, that, that history of kind of you know, you did this once, I did that once, and we have a lot of, you know, laughs about that stuff. But then these finance conversations do come in from time to time and you're like, well, what are you doing here and how are you handling that? And yeah, it's really tricky. I think, um, oh, my gosh.

Speaker 1:

Sorry, I know I stumped you with that question.

Speaker 2:

I've never been like actually stumped like this before. This is great.

Speaker 1:

I love it when I come up with questions that stump the guest.

Speaker 2:

It's very good. I think it would be around just the way the world's going and just how things are now and we talk a lot about how difficult things are for people it's really tricky Relationships how it's so hard in relationships now to figure out these things and how you've got like lots of people saying you should never you should never combine your finances with your partner. And then you've got other people who combine all their finances with their partner and it's quite polarizing, that kind of stuff.

Speaker 2:

Um, I think buying houses is yes it's tricky because you we talk a lot about that, about how do you even do that, how do you even get on the property ladder or how do you scale up when you've run out of space and you need a bit more space. You started having kids, um, but yeah, I think we probably talk a lot about investing as well.

Speaker 2:

Uh, I'm very careful what I talk about with of course, investing online, but I think we can talk a bit bit more freely behind closed doors, um, but yeah, I think the point is, though, we should be talking with our friends about money and we should have like candid conversations to the point we feel comfortable, right, I don't disclose like figures. Yeah, some people are like, oh, you should tell your friends, everyone should disclose how much savings they have. I'm like, why would you do that?

Speaker 2:

like, if you don't feel comfortable, don't do that yeah like there's a lot of um emotions around money and and even what your earnings are and things. I don't think you should necessarily have to disclose all this stuff, but I think the point is having conversations about money in some regard is really important, I agree and just like that being a normal thing.

Speaker 1:

I agree. I think, when it comes to actually having those conversations with friends, I found it in my friendship groups that my friends are super happy talking to me individually about money, but when it comes to a collective, there was almost just like, oh, I don't know where everyone's at and I try and encourage it. You know, I think it is so important to talk about money. What are you doing? What are your goals? Are you saving into a pension? What does that look like? You've moved jobs, you know those kind of things.

Speaker 1:

But I think we need to have way more of it and not just talk about it when it's too late Because I have I have a friend at the moment who is going through the home buying process and it's amazing and we're like overjoyed. And in that same conversation that she announced it, she was like so when it's free or very low cost, because you know I can't afford it. But that was such a candid conversation that I think a lot of people for me obviously that's normal, but a lot of their other friends felt like, oh, wow, you actually said that and it probably made them feel more empowered to voice. You know when, when they're they're feeling things are a bit tight, you can just say it and everyone's, everyone's like, okay, yeah, it makes sense, I agree and I think it's really important.

Speaker 2:

I think these, the moments like that, are a real test of friendship, because I think everyone's gonna have these phases in life where, hopefully, you're you've got a bit more cash, you know available and you're feeling a bit more like spendy spendy.

Speaker 2:

And then other moments like that where you've bought home and you're like there's zero, like we are, we've wiped out just to get this house yeah and I think that can be quite difficult because, especially if you're you're in a bit of a mismatch of this person here in the group you know they're earning really well. This person's not so much at the moment. That person's just lost their job. That can really test friendships and it can be really difficult, especially if there's like events you want to go to, like hen do's trips, and for some person that's easy, it's an easy yes, and for somebody else it's really hard to find the money. And I think it's just really important to say about like bearing with people and kind of patience and trying to be understanding and they might make a decision that you don't get, but actually it's an emotional thing and they might be really stressed. So I mean bringing feelings into the conversation, like how are you doing?

Speaker 2:

Like how are you feeling about this? Okay, you said you can't come, but what's going on Like? Do you want to talk about it? Remembering it's emotional and not just being like, oh it's so annoying they can't go, just going, you know you're is so cute.

Speaker 1:

I've had situations, even with friends as well, where they say they can't come. But when you dig deeper, you know maybe finances are tight, but then their mental health is also being affected. So I might say, okay, cool, well, you should just come out, I'll cover you. Don't worry about paying me back, because your mental health needs us more, so you need to be your friends more. But again, all of these only comes out when you have conversations if we take in the first answer okay, you can't come.

Speaker 1:

You know that would have been left there. So I think, yeah, the point you brought up is it's very important to have these conversations with friends and just normalize them, as we always say, and you and I are always encouraging that. But I think it is so important and a lot of people who listen to the podcast are in their 20s just figuring it out. Okay, you are the expert. You are the expert of the 20s because you've lived through it. I'm still in it so no, but you live through it, so you know what it's like. Okay, I think sometimes, when you're in your 20s, you're thinking what on earth is this? I'm nearing the end now, so hopefully I've heard it's brighter on the other side. But for anyone who's in their 20s, what are the three things that they should prioritize to get themselves in order financially?

Speaker 2:

great question. I think things I wish I'd done right. Okay, build an emergency fund. Yeah, really basic now, like wow, when I started teaching stuff, no one knew what emergency fund was right.

Speaker 2:

This was like five years ago nowadays that people I think it's become more of our day-to-day chat um, but you can do that quite if you do it. If you start small, so like say, from your first paycheck, you've just come out of uni or something, you've just got a job, you come out of school, you can just like do, like, right, I'm just gonna do 10% and I'm just gonna gradually build it, or even 5% if you can't manage 10, just to build that emergency fund, because once it's done it's like, oh, I can relax.

Speaker 1:

I've got money just in case something happens.

Speaker 2:

I need to. You know I can, I can, yeah, I think. Emergency funds, a massive one, I would say I think. Learn money, learn finance, learn investing, understand it, get your head around it, because it will open up the world to you. You'll realize assets is what builds wealth, not just your nine to five and it all going out every paycheck. You'll learn all these things that if you can learn them in your 20s and even just start in some small way building those in, then you're going to do very well the rest of your life. Three things you wanted, okay, so oh, another one would be, I think, just giving yourself the time to make mistakes and learn and fail and try stuff out in your 20s. Because, yeah, 20s, everyone hypes up your 20s and then you get there and you're like what am I? What is this?

Speaker 2:

that's what I'm feeling yeah, it's so hard it's like I'm trying to buy a house, I'm trying to save, I'm trying to do this, I'm trying to start a career. I don't know what I'm doing. Should I start a family? I don't know. Will I find the person I want to spend the rest of my life? It is so hard and I think I came out of uni and it hit me in the face. It was a yeah, I had. I struggled with my mental health in my 20s, like massively. I just didn't know what. I didn't know enough about myself. I'd just been on that, like I said, that conveyor belt of you've always got the next thing. You've always got A levels, then maybe a degree, or maybe you've started a job, and then your 20s, it all stops and you have to just create your own goals. So yeah, space to space to just experiment and make mistakes. That's another thing, that's a good thing.

Speaker 1:

I love that one, especially the last one, because I think, like you said, you don't realize how much you were on a conveyor belt until you're chucked off. Yeah, so no, you're chucked off so abruptly. Yeah, because I thought when you go through the schooling system, you know what is almost like a right path and maybe not a great path. You know, you know you should stay in school and get your grades and not true and and drop out of school. So you know that. But then you get to university. If you go, if you don't go, then you have that much early on. But I went, and then you graduate and it's like, oh my gosh, amazing, well done, yeah, and that's it. Everyone leaves you. Okay, that's it, and you're meant to figure out. Okay, so I get a job, but how do I get a job? Okay, I apply, but what does this mean? How long am I staying here? This is my life. Have I decided? This is me.

Speaker 1:

And it's so hard to figure that out. And I think the fact that you said that you should even give yourself room to make mistakes with money is so important because, especially with social media, you feel as though you need to be perfect from the jump. You should know exactly what you're doing and have the perfect lifestyle. When you're like 22 and I'm seeing some of the money that these young kids are spending now just to go out, and I'm like, why are you going to a 400 pound restaurant? I wouldn't even go. And why are you, 19, going to this 400 pound restaurant? And it's insane. The standards have increased that now you feel like you've got to have the money and you've got to have an idea of what you're doing, when in reality, no one knows.

Speaker 2:

No, no one really has it figured out basically a lot not everything that's too extreme, but a lot of what you see online is on a credit card it's not they don't really have the money like even a lot of influencers.

Speaker 2:

They don't really have the money, it's just been paid for on a credit card and they've got tons of debt. That that is the reality and it's just not real. And and also we all know that when we post stuff online, you're going to show your your best self. You're going to show your site, you're shiny, like oh, this is me on a good day, I don't post myself on a bad day, like on a bad day, I won't post a thing.

Speaker 1:

I'm stressed and crying.

Speaker 2:

I don't post that You're not going to see that side of things.

Speaker 2:

And I think that's one of the scary things about the online world now is you know you need people in your actual real life to hold like, to keep you grounded and actually, like we're saying about friendship conversations you know, conversations with your friends about money. You know how are you actually doing. Can you really afford that thing that you just got? You know someone that will just talk with you, that actually knows you on the day-to-day, and online relationships are great or online, you know, friendships are great, whatever but they don't really know you in the day-to-day and I think having that people around you that will keep you grounded and call you out when you're being a bit silly is just a good thing absolutely.

Speaker 1:

I couldn't agree more. I think you need those people to help you to remember, helping to remember and put it in perspective. You know, I've had friends where they might be doing something. I'm like I think you're saving for a house and they're like, ah, yeah, you're right, you know, but if you put it online, everyone's like, oh my gosh, that's amazing. You did shopping. So you need other people to kind of remind you of who you are and maybe what your goals are.

Speaker 2:

You can do that, but you sure you want to do that?

Speaker 1:

you know you need that on that just quickly.

Speaker 2:

Like in terms of life partners right, my husband. I never, literally never talk about my husband, but in terms of people that keep you in a good space, one of the things that I am so glad that I have but I never would have particularly looked for, but I just think is a good thing to look for when you're looking for a partner is it's that balance of we will happily save for a big goal together. We think big as a couple, like together we, when we're having money conversations, we're like we should go for this, we should try and do this. Yeah, cool, let's take this risk or let's be really sensible here so we can build this savings pool. Really good on that. But he's also the guy that would be like midweek, nah, let's just sack it off and go through a stroke and it's that lovely balance. And he's like keeps generosity. He's like often more generous than I am with people and do it like pushing me to be more generous.

Speaker 2:

And I think you know in your 20s again coming back to that thing of like you, some people will be looking for the right person. And you know, one of the biggest reasons couples don't last is because of finance problems and difficulties in relationships around money. Um, so I think when you're you're kind of dating and you're exploring these things, these are things to look for, these are things to you know. Are you aligned in stuff like that? Are they the type of person that will go for stuff with you and kind of dream with you?

Speaker 2:

and then also be generous, but also have fun and let off steam occasionally. So it's like these qualities are really, really important. But then let me ask you this?

Speaker 1:

how do you figure that out if you're in your 20s and let's not say first date, but let's say you've been on a few dates with someone you're like, I kind of like them? However, the conversation of money is the one conversation we haven't had yet and it's just awkward. Like again, you and I, we don't find it awkward but it's what we do, but for most people I understand, it's an awkward conversation. How do you ask you know not necessarily how much do you earn? I don't need the figure, but what are your goals? Are you saving towards stuff? What kind of spender are you? Are you a splurge or do you just spend because life's short? I've heard that people just spend all their money because, oh, I can't take it with me, so I just spend it all today. You know how do you bring in those conversations from early to understand if you were lying to someone yeah, I think you can learn a lot from just observing them.

Speaker 2:

So if the conversation's too awkward right now, you can just watch how they are how they are with other people when the bill comes out, what do they do? What? Their micro expressions, are they stressed? Are they quick to jump on it?

Speaker 1:

are they?

Speaker 2:

wanting you to pay, like all these things. And I'm not saying anything's right and wrong, I'm just saying you, you need to look and observe and see how they're handling things and and you can observe quite a lot just from looking at them in different situations and how they're doing. Also, you can learn a lot from their family, watching them in their family dynamic, their parents or carers like what was their relationship with like, like with money? Have they? Have they talked about that? And that can be a really good in on the conversation too. Like, oh, so how, what's your? You know, what's it been like for you growing up? Like how are things? Because you can kind of segue in then rather than like so are you spendy, are you like, do you have a pension, like?

Speaker 2:

so there be ways of kind of just segwaying into the conversation rather than coming out of it straight. But I think, yeah, I think when I was dating my husband, I was watching. I was watching a lot and just being how are you in this situation? How are you showing up here? What are you doing when somebody's talking about that? How do you respond and learn a lot? And then that and then that kept me interested because I was like I like how you did that? That was really cool actually, and I like you know, and then actually he, he brought up a lot of stuff and I think it's quite nice, but it is going to be awkward, like there's no, there's no, don't get around it yeah, because it might be that you really like a person but then they actually come out with a clangor and you're like whoa, we're really not aligned and that's hard, that is but it.

Speaker 2:

But it's good to have that chat.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, I think you need to have it sooner rather than later, and when I say sooner, I mean don't wait two years. And then all of a sudden you find out that they're in crippling debt and you're like, oh my gosh, she's not the person I wanted. You need to have that conversation somewhat early on, or gauge somewhat early on if they're your person. So I think a lot of people will appreciate that. Anna, like I said, we're learning from you. We're learning from you. Everyone in their 20s listening, or even early 30s, we're learning from you. So, thank you. If someone listening right now is struggling, not just financially, but let's just also add in the emotional element, what would you say to them?

Speaker 2:

I would. I think the first thing I'd say is like, look, times are really hard right now and the world's a bit crazy, and probably a lot of what you're seeing, like we've already said, online is going to make you feel like you're doing worse than you are. When you look at the stats in the UK, a lot of people are struggling, a lot of people don't have savings. Um, it's, it's a crazy world right now, and then I'd probably say something like you know, wherever you're at, there's always a next step. There's always, there's always something you can do, and if you don't feel like you can do it, there's someone that can help you for free. Like if people a lot of people still don't know about the services that are offered for free for people that are in debt.

Speaker 2:

They just don't know about them, and I think there's incredible charities out there that will just literally walk with you step by step through, getting you back on your feet and guide you, and not ask for any money. Just they're there to serve you. So there's that's really important. But I think that I think a reassuring voice in those moments is really helpful and I think helping them find that next step, the first thing they can do that they feel actually, yeah, I could do that whether that's starting, you know, looking at their budget or having get them to look through their accounts and seeing where their money's going.

Speaker 2:

You know that might be too big a step right now. You know there's lots of things you can do, but it's finding yeah, okay, I can do that, let's do that. And then let's see that work and then let's do the next thing and then let's see that work and then you build from there.

Speaker 1:

I love that. I think, yeah, you've just taken that step. I think the tendency to feel overwhelmed and to stop, yeah, and stopping is it feels like the thing you should do, but it's probably the complete opposite of what you should do. You should figure out what the next step is and, like you said, there are so many charities and so many places that are just willing to help that people should be aware of. So make sure you put it in the episode description and all the links will be there if you need that help, because it's there, so you may as well make use of it. And, yeah, take it on before we round off, when we get to our last game of the episode, because I know you love the first game.

Speaker 1:

I want to talk to you about your book. Oh, okay, I'm excited. I want you to talk to us about your book because Because for me, as book twins, I obviously have your book. I was very proud of you and I read your book and to me, your book feels like it just sits at an intersection of money, confidence and identity, right, I think not a lot of books bring that in. So I want to ask you what inspired you to write it, number one, and what do you hope readers take away from the book? So, everyone, this is the point where I highly encourage everyone to buy Money Mentor. But yeah, what inspired you to write it and what do you hope people take away?

Speaker 2:

I think so. Firstly, I got asked to write it, which was one of the most weirdest days of my entire life when I got that email. Yeah, I did not see it coming.

Speaker 1:

Really of my entire life when I got that email.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, I I did not see it coming. I did not see it coming. I was just posting videos, content online, and then I got this email and I thought it was spam. Because I was like, dude, like what is that? Who is this publishing company? What? Um, wasn't spam. And I was like, wow, this is not. This is not what I had on my bingo card, like literally. So that was incredible.

Speaker 2:

So then I had to get over that and be like well, I knew straight away what I would write about, because I already was teaching people and I already saw it working. So I was like that is what I want to put in a book. I just want to take people on a journey of I'm stuck, don't know what I'm doing, to. I'm now thriving, moving forward. I've got my foundations done and now I'm like looking at ways to multiply my money and grow it in the future. So that's what I knew that I wanted to do. But, yeah, it was a real shocker and I'm so glad that I I got that opportunity. It's one of the the most amazing things I've ever had the privilege of doing in my entire life. I'm sure you'd say this absolutely it's just like such an incredible journey.

Speaker 2:

I loved writing it. And the reason I loved writing it is because so I had this mad panic at the start, right. So I had this lovely editor, holly, who was coaching me through the whole process and she was like I had this, this got the contact during in the summer, and then I had a lunch with her and I was sitting there and I just had this like bit of a breakdown. I was like okay, so like, um, yeah, I'm just really worried because like, uh, like, like, like peers are gonna read this and they're gonna like what if I say stuff wrong and like. And I was literally having like one of those crisis moments.

Speaker 2:

And then she just said the most amazing thing to me. She was just like you know, you're not writing it for your peers, you're not writing it for these.

Speaker 2:

Like amazing experts, they know this stuff already you're writing it to the people that you talk to online. What do they need to hear? And then I got over myself completely because I realized get over yourself, anna, write this as a letter to them, like, write it. Like you're literally writing them a letter, saying like guys, I see you, I've got you, this is what you need to know. And then that just set me off, because I just got into a little routine. I, I sat in a little cafe, wrote it all pretty much in one, this one spot, in one cafe, and I just wrote it like from my heart, like a letter start to finish, and I was just like, okay, this is what I needed to write. So there we are.

Speaker 1:

It's an incredible book and it's amazing to sometimes get the behind the scenes of the process, because everyone sees the finished product but no one knows what actually went into it and the thoughts that you have going into it and writing a book. So I completely understand. I felt the exact same way, yeah, when you're actually writing books. But it's amazing. Now it has to be the most important question would you write another one?

Speaker 2:

I would love to would you?

Speaker 2:

I love the process, like we're saying earlier, being creative people, like when you get into a groove when you're being creative, it's such a lovely thing. You just kind of like it's just some people hate writing books and it's like one of the most painful things they've ever had to do. Not me, I loved it. I just I sat there and I was like this is a privilege, like I can't know, like hard, but I loved it and I think I would love to write another one. But I think I don't want to write something unless it needs writing, if you know what I mean that's exactly how I thought.

Speaker 1:

Yeah right.

Speaker 2:

So it feels like if I found the thing that I think needs saying, I would be like cool, I'd love to do that. But right now I feel like there's there's stuff that I'm experimenting with. I'm teaching more on um, what I'm facilitating, I would say teaching more on um investing. I feel like, especially with the gender investment gap in the UK, I feel like we just need to do more to help women feel confident investing, and so I'm trying to do things with that at the moment. Um, which is all very experimental at this stage, um, but feels important and I don't quite know how that's gonna look, but I feel like I need to just run that course and just like run the course of that, I mean, and just see how that goes um before I start anything else but um yeah, would you?

Speaker 1:

would I love that. So we're gonna see a new one. Uh, yes, yes, but the way I described it I just want to preface it I have no kids you do, but it's how I imagine for some people and perhaps me, when I have kids is that when you're actually pregnant, you're like oh my gosh, I'll never do this again. Right, are you like? I will never do this again. This is horrible. I feel dreadful. I look dreadful. Then you have your child and then after a couple of months, you're like oh my gosh, this is amazing, I want another.

Speaker 1:

So that's how I felt like writing the book, and I was doing it. I was so honored doing it. I felt amazing. And it felt amazing to write the book, but during it I was like this is so much, I would never do this again. I was like I'm one and done. I literally one and done Enjoy the book, you're. And then it's been out and I'm like, oh, I'd love to do another one. That's how I feel now. So now I'm in the point where I'm like yeah, but like you, I wouldn't write it unless it needed to be written. I don't want to write a book for book's sake, the same way we were speaking off camera. Just when it comes to even content creating, you want to create content for content's sake. You want it to actually have a purpose.

Speaker 2:

Well, well, I'm just gonna say it so it's on record, I can see it for you and I think it's gonna be amazing. So oh, thank you, that's how I'm just, I'm just looking at that down the line and I'm like, yeah I hope so.

Speaker 1:

It'll be great. Obviously this book was for 11 plus, so it'd be great to I don't know, I don't know, maybe an analyst book, I don't know. Yeah, it'll be, it'll be interesting, but hopefully we're book twins again yeah, we're the same part.

Speaker 2:

Wouldn't that be so cool? That would be so cool, that would be actually really cool.

Speaker 1:

You never know. You never know, anna. This has been incredible. Thank you so much. You've provided so much insight to our listeners and now we're going to end the episode. Before we get to where people can follow you, we're going to end it with a game. So the game is called Rich or Ridiculous. Okay, so this is where I have six statements on my card. There is no time limit, so there's no need to rush like we did earlier. There are six statements and I want you to basically tell me whether it's rich, as in something we should be doing, or ridiculous, and give me a short reason why okay, how long did you say we've got for each one?

Speaker 1:

no, you've got. No, there's no time limit, so you can take your time. Yep, this is not pressurised one, but I want you to tell me rich or ridiculous and give me a reason. Okay, okay, first one quitting your job to protect your peace rich if you've got an emergency fund ridiculous if you don't not necessarily ridiculous, but I mean, oh gosh, it's hard, isn't it?

Speaker 2:

because workplaces can be so difficult and actually can really be very difficult for mental health. So there are moments where it's like, and you know, actually I've done this. I'm just thinking about it, I did do this.

Speaker 2:

I had a job when I came out of uni. It was a great job, but after a while I was just so, I was not doing okay. I was not doing okay and it wasn't actually financially that sensible to to not carry on. But I knew I needed to take the leap and I I'm glad I did. I don't regret the job. My job is amazing. The people I work with are amazing, so it wasn't workplace problem, it was me figuring out who I am and yeah. So I did do this and I'm so glad I did so. Let's say, rich rich.

Speaker 1:

I like that, that's. I like that number two prioritizing self-care over savings to an extent, self-care is like unbounded yes because I could just go like straight after this. I could be like you know what I need, I just need to go to the spa and I need to get my nails done and I need to get my hair done and I need to get a massage and there's like you could just carry on.

Speaker 2:

It's true so it's kind of, I would say it's more about which looks like. For me. It looks like what are the actual things that move the dial for me that in a month, when I do those things, wow, I'm a better person, I'm a nicer person, I feel more grounded, I feel more like rested. For me it's been like a bit of a journey, because going from like really like money was so tight when we had our kids and now having a bit more space to move and move around, I actually find it hard to spend money on myself wow, so my husband's often like dude just yeah, you just actually go and do the thing, like just it's okay, I find it quite hard, but when I do I love it so it's like okay, you know like I should do it more, so I

Speaker 2:

found a few things like even like just working out um, yeah, sometimes get my nails done, making sure my hair's done, like it's just a few little things like that. I'm like I'm done, that's it, that's what I need. Got it okay. And even just like a few bougie items on the shop yeah, why not?

Speaker 1:

oh my gosh, why?

Speaker 2:

not when it comes in. I'm like yes, yes, so glad I bought that exactly, but yeah, it's gonna be different for everyone, isn't it?

Speaker 1:

it's true. It's true.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, I love that next one moving back in with your parents at 30 to reset financially I would say rich I agree if, as long as you've got a good relationship with them, and it's you know, it's not gonna cause any problems. I think that's the way things are right now, which we would obviously love to be in a different position, where it's like you come out, you get a job, you save and you can get a house and you can do your own thing, but we asked, like, if you the other side of this, though, is is you're privileged if you're able to do that I actually spoke to someone once who was in that position and had just done exactly that to save for a house, and they felt so embarrassed talking about it like as in, like they weren't set like being independent, and I was like, no, you're being wise, you are gonna.

Speaker 2:

They had a plan. They knew exactly when they'd get to their target. I just thought, wow, well done you know you shouldn't be embarrassed about that.

Speaker 2:

You've really worked this out and you've worked out your parents. There was all good vibes, it was all good and I just I just thought that's something to be. If you can do it, you it's a privilege to be able to do it and also, as long as it's time banded and you're not taking advantage, you know you've got like, I know I can get to this point in this amount of months.

Speaker 1:

I think it's a good thing in in today's world yeah, I like that, not having a five-year plan, but still living well rich, rich yeah I don't have a five-year plan, but still living well, rich, rich.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, I don't have a five-year plan in our industry, it's really hard to have a five-year plan.

Speaker 1:

I mean it if you, if you make any kind of plan, in my opinion, anything longer than 12 months, I think the universe wants to laugh in your face.

Speaker 2:

It says I agree with you. Yeah, I don't know if, like top ceos in the country, would agree but they probably wouldn't. But in our industry, whatever plan you hand is going to be thrown to the wayside yeah, but we've seen so much happen in the last few years, like covid, like all the stuff cost of living crisis, it's just, I feel like we're having to learn to pivot better. As you know human beings, we're having to navigate quicker and just adapt. So, yeah, five years seems like a long time.

Speaker 1:

It's a long time. A lot can change in five years, that's for sure. Last two, so last one, penultimate one, spending 200 pounds a month on therapy, even when money's tight.

Speaker 2:

In a crunch point in your life it could be absolutely the right thing to do, so that could be rich sometimes. That is the kind of the bit of hope that people have that they've got that therapist and they can see them when times are really dark. For people, that can be their lifeline. So to to do that, even when money's tight, because you need to, because you know that's going to be a thing that gets you through the other side, that can be an incredible decision to make.

Speaker 1:

I like that. The last one, buying a £1,000 bag to celebrate your first freelance paycheck. That's how much the paycheck is. I know it depends how much it is, doesn't it?

Speaker 2:

If it's a big one, I get it £1,000 paycheck and then you spend a thousand on your bag.

Speaker 1:

Oh my gosh, that would be terrible, do you?

Speaker 2:

imagine yeah, I don't even, I'm not into bags, Kia, Never mind I am or shoes.

Speaker 1:

What are you into then?

Speaker 2:

Really nice food and cocktails.

Speaker 1:

Oh, I was about to say see if we can adapt it for what you're into yeah, that's better for you. With all my favourite people.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, I'll just be like guys are going out let's go.

Speaker 1:

That's it. It's on me. I got paid for the first time free lunch.

Speaker 2:

I would, I would, I'd do it, I would. It's bad, isn't it? No, it's rich.

Speaker 1:

It's rich. It's rich you so much. This has been an incredible episode and the games were so much fun. The games are great. You're a great sport. Thank you, no, honestly, it was so much fun. Before we round off, where can people listen and watching, find out more about you and your book?

Speaker 2:

come and find me at mentora with an a on the end money. I thought that was a really good name when I came up with it and now everyone's like mentor anyway it's all right, mentor money on Money on Instagram. Or Anna Braiding on TikTok. That's where I hang out and that's where I post the most. Or LinkedIn. I'm Anna Braiding on there, mentoramoneycom, you can find all my resources and tools and the book, so check it out.

Speaker 1:

Amazing. Thank you so much. Thanks for having me. We'll be back again next week with another episode. Bye, guys.